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Sam Brownback
Transcript of Sam Brownback during the third Republican presidential primary debate in New Hampshire (2008 election) (June 05 2007)
BLITZER: Senator Brownback, you're also a member of the United States Senate. Did you read that classified national intelligence estimate? SEN. SAM BROWNBACK (R), KANSAS: I don't remember that report. I had a number of briefings and I held a number of committee hearings. At that time, I was chairing the Middle East Subcommittee on Foreign Relations. And we held hearings on this topic and what was taking place and what Saddam was doing. But the issue is that we've got to put forward, now, a political plan. And that's something I'm going to introduce tomorrow, a political plan to create a three-state solution in Iraq: a Kurdish state, a Sunni state, a Shia state. Because Iraq is more three groups held together by exterior forces. And that's what we've lacked is a political plan to get us moving forward in success.
FAHEY: Senator Brownback, President Bush has stated that states that sponsor terrorism are no different than terrorists themselves. Yet Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice recently met with Iranian officials to discuss security in Iraq. Iran is a known support of Hezbollah, Hamas. Did President Bush make the right call in opening a dialogue with Iran? BROWNBACK: I think he made a right call on saying that about terrorist states, particularly Iran. But I think we have to at times talk with them in different situations. Like, before we went into Afghanistan, we talked with Iran. It wasn't we were negotiating. We didn't open up formal diplomatic relations and we shouldn't. Iran is the lead sponsor of terrorism. Ahmadinejad just this past week called for the destruction of Israel, continues to call for attacking of the United States. On Iraq, I think we need to talk with them. I think we have to confront them aggressively for what they are, which is the lead sponsor of terrorism in the world. I think we need to push the sanctions forward more aggressively. I think we need to work with the labor union movement that's developing inside of Iran. You had a bus driver strike that recently took place. And I think we have to show that purpose and resolve, that we're going to confront these guys and we're going to stand with our allies like Israel, we're going to stand against them oppressing and pushing us, and trying to fund terrorists against us.
BLITZER: Thank you, Congressman. Congressman Hunter, let me bring. . .
BROWNBACK: Senator, if you don't mind.
BLITZER: Excuse me, Senator.
BROWNBACK: That's OK.
BLITZER: Senator Brownback, what do you say about this notion of a pathway toward citizenship for these 12 million illegal immigrants who are in the country right now? Under what circumstances would you let them begin that path? BROWNBACK: I don't think you create any new paths to citizenship. But I also think you allow them to be able to use paths that they would currently qualify for, and to be able to get in the back of the line. And that's part of leadership and getting something resolved. I think, you know, we can go on a lot of slogans here. And I've been around this issue for a while. I was in Congress in 1994, elected then. We did the first immigration bill I was involved in then in 1996. You know what? That was an enforcement-only bill in 1996. And we had 7 million undocumented here in the country then. We're at 12 million to 20 million now. The point of saying that -- and my colleagues and people up here, everybody is concerned that we get something done and get something right. I think if you do exterior enforcement, border enforcement, you do aggressive interior enforcement, and then you work on a comprehensive solution interior, that's something that a lot of people are going to be upset with but that can work and move us forward. And it's better than not doing anything.
BLITZER: Thank you. So you support this pending compromise legislation? BROWNBACK: If we can hold together those things in it. Those things have to be in it.
BLITZER: You're with Senator McCain.
BROWNBACK: If those things are in it.
BLITZER: What about you, Governor Thompson? THOMPSON: Wolf, the first thing you have to do is you've got to secure the border. Securing the border is going to allow everything else to follow. But unless you secure the border, it is not right to give 12 million individuals who have illegal rights in this country status before that border is protected. There should be no amnesty. And this bill, no matter how you cover it, is an amnesty bill. And the people in this country do not believe in that bill. And they believe very much that the best hope for us to have a secure border, just like Congressman Hunter has been talking about and every other Republican up here. Have a secure border, then move on. But don't do it the other way. BLITZER: Senator Brownback, you recently elaborated on your position on this, and I wonder if you'd want to spend 30 seconds and tell our audience out there where you stand on the issue of evolution.
BROWNBACK: I'd be happy to. And it's interesting that we're doing this here at St. Anselm's, who this -- that saint had a philosophy of faith seeking reason. And that's the issue that's missing here, if I could highlight that point, is that I believe that we are created in the image of God for a particular purpose. And I believe that with all my heart. And I'm somebody, I've had cancer in the past, I've had a season to really look at this and study it and think about the end of life. And I am fully convinced there's a god of the universe that loves us very much and was involved in the process. How he did it, I don't know. One of the problems we have with our society today is that we've put faith and science at odds with each other. They aren't at odds with each other. If they are, check your faith or check your science, and we should have a discussion.
BLITZER: Thank you.
BROWNBACK: And we should engage faith and reason like St. Anselm did.
BLITZER: Thank you.
BROWNBACK: That's something we should do. (APPLAUSE) BLITZER: Senator Brownback, same question to you: If you're elected president, what would you ask your predecessor to do? BROWNBACK: Well, I would talk with him about it first, and I would ask him about it. I think he would probably take a position the way his dad did, saying, 'You know, I think you need to have your time in the limelight. And I will be willing to help out if you have a tragedy overseas. ' His father has been excellent, in the tsunami that hit Sri Lanka and other places, in helping fund-raising. He's been a wonderful ambassador in those sorts of situations. And frankly, I think that's the right role for an ex-president. And I really think, in many respects, President Clinton has not assumed the right role of an ex-president, where he's injected himself a lot more on policy issues that haven't been appropriate, and he really should defer more to the person that's in the job. There's one person that's president at a time, and that's the way it should be.
BLITZER: I just want to do a quick 'yes' or 'no. ' And I'm going to go down the rest of the group and let everybody just tell me 'yes' or 'no': Would you pardon Scooter Libby? BROWNBACK: No, not without reading the transcript.
BROWNBACK: Yes. The basic crime here didn't happen. What they were saying was that the identity of an agent... BLITZER: All right. BROWNBACK: ... was revealed, but that agent has to be in the field for that to be a crime. That didn't occur.
BLITZER: Senator Brownback, I'd like you to weigh in.
BROWNBACK: If I could. And thank you for your family's service and what your brother did. That's incredible and an incredible gift that he and your family have given us. And I think you've identified the right thing. It's not about leaving, and it's not about being defeated. It's about getting the situation to a point that we can turn it over to Iraqis, and then us pull back from the front of the line. That's why I'm putting forward tomorrow a bill, and this would be about a three-state solution in Iraq -- a Kurdish state, a Sunni state, a Shia state -- with Baghdad as the federal city, in a loose, weak, federated system; oil revenues equally divided. And it's a bipartisan bill. We will have bipartisan support. We've got to pull together here to win over there.
BLITZER: Senator. . .
BROWNBACK: And we can do this together, but we haven't put yet forward, this administration, a political solution that will be long- term and durable.
BLITZER: Thank you. Thank you, Senator.
BROWNBACK: That's what we've got to do.
BLITZER: Thank you, Congressman. Senator Brownback really wants to weigh in, as well.
BROWNBACK: Thank you. And thank you for the question from a philosopher. I think it's the life issue clearly, and I'm pro-life and I'm whole life. And one of the things I'm the most -- the proudest about our party about is that we've stood for life. We've been a party that has stood for a culture of life. And it was in our platform in 1980, and it continues today. And with that respect -- and I have respect for my other colleagues -- that's why I don't think we can nominate somebody that's not pro-life in this party, because it is at our core. We believe that every life is beautiful, is sacred, is a child of a loving God from natural -- from conception to natural death. And that applies not only here and in the womb, it applies to somebody that's in poverty, it applies to the child in Darfur. And that philosophy, being pro-life and whole life, is something I think can really help move us forward as a country and as a party. (APPLAUSE) BLITZER: Senator, if Rudy Giuliani got the Republican presidential nomination, would you be able to support him? BROWNBACK: That question came up at the first debate, and I stated that this is something that we as a party have struggled with. I have great respect for the mayor. I don't think we're going to nominate somebody that's not pro-life.
BLITZER: Would you be able to support him? BROWNBACK: I can support and will support the nominee of our party. But our party has stood on principles. It's a party of principles. It's not a party of personalities. We lose when we walk away from our principles. That's when we have trouble. And that's the country wants us to do. . .
BLITZER: Thank you, Senator.
BROWNBACK: . . . is to stand for principles. (APPLAUSE) BLITZER: Senator? BROWNBACK: Spending, but it's bigger than that. It's hope and ideas, and I want one -- I have one I want to put on the line here. Taking on cancer and deaths by cancer, and ending deaths by cancer in 10 years. The leading cause of fear in America today is that you'll get cancer. And this is one that's actually within our reach, and it is something I think we can go at and we should go at, and it touches a lot of Americans.
Sam Brownback
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